Over the past four years, Paul W. Downs has been one of the people responsible for constructing the ongoing story of a lifer standup comic on the show Hacks. Paul talks with Marc about how his comedy background is very different from the fictional Deborah Vance, with his training at the UCB Theater, his days at the vanguard of internet video comedy, and his entry into the world of Broad City. They also talk about embarrassment, becoming less odd with age, and the current crisis in comedy development.